Insights on Sales Enablement Metrics from Carly Lehner

Carly Lehner is the Global Head of Sales Enablement at Axiom.  She joined The Collaborator to discuss her work running a global enablement program, onboarding effectively in the age of covid, and some of the best metrics (and worse) to use for measuring her teams efforts.

1️⃣Carly has a team of two:  Carly and Emma (a former BDR); supporting around 150 commercial teammates, about half of which are sellers who carry a quota.

2️⃣At Axiom, Enablement reports to Ops who then reports into the head of sales.  One of the benefits of this relationship is that the team is extremely data-focused, an area where many enablement teams struggle.

3️⃣Sales leaders are a primary audience for their efforts; key for identifying the highest priority projects and driving adoption.

4️⃣Carly has a passion for creating amazing sales on-boarding programs.  One of the best things she does is monthly check-ins with all sellers as they grow into the company, providing support and celebrating successes.  

Best metric for success?  Quota Consistency.  How many months in a row are sellers achieving quota.  Teams with longer sales cycles can modify this metric to better align with their business (e.g. x discovery calls a month), but a good idea to measure consistency of performance over time.

5️⃣Carly recommends call recordings as a great tool for training new hires.  Helps new hires understand what good looks like and to map out their own approaches.

Transcript

0:00:00.160,0:00:03.679 more the collaborator and i’m here with0:00:02.480,0:00:06.799 carly laner0:00:03.679,0:00:08.880 um carly i pitched this as0:00:06.799,0:00:10.480 it’s an american in london is it a love0:00:08.880,0:00:13.200 story or a story of0:00:10.480,0:00:14.799 global enablement i guess we’ll have to0:00:13.200,0:00:17.359 find out over the next0:00:14.799,0:00:17.840 30 minutes i guess so tell us a little0:00:17.359,0:00:19.039 bit0:00:17.840,0:00:22.560 tell us a little bit about yourself0:00:19.039,0:00:25.599 though um so yes i’m american i0:00:22.560,0:00:26.800 am born and raised in portland oregon so0:00:25.599,0:00:29.840 i am definitely0:00:26.800,0:00:31.679 a big fan of the pacific northwest um oh0:00:29.840,0:00:34.880 my virtual background cut off my0:00:31.679,0:00:37.440 uh my yeti has a sticker i was wondering0:00:34.880,0:00:37.440 it was okay0:00:38.000,0:00:43.280 but i moved here at the beginning of0:00:39.440,0:00:44.800 2018 my husband has dual citizenship so0:00:43.280,0:00:46.960 he’s always wanted to live over in0:00:44.800,0:00:48.239 england and you know we were newly0:00:46.960,0:00:51.440 married no kids0:00:48.239,0:00:53.199 no house we said why not so here we are0:00:51.440,0:00:54.640 i’ve been here two and a half years like0:00:53.199,0:00:57.840 i said we we love it0:00:54.640,0:00:58.239 it’s um it’s great living in london it0:00:57.840,0:01:00.719 has0:00:58.239,0:01:01.760 definitely has its perks both a love0:01:00.719,0:01:04.239 story0:01:01.760,0:01:05.040 and a story of enablement yeah there you0:01:04.239,0:01:08.000 go0:01:05.040,0:01:08.000 i think i know both0:01:08.479,0:01:12.240 you work for a global business it’s0:01:11.520,0:01:15.920 headquartered0:01:12.240,0:01:16.799 in the us though correct so tell us a0:01:15.920,0:01:19.200 little bit about0:01:16.799,0:01:20.320 what that’s like you know working0:01:19.200,0:01:22.799 between you know0:01:20.320,0:01:24.320 working in london with a global business0:01:22.799,0:01:25.600 but headquartered in the us tell us a0:01:24.320,0:01:27.680 little bit about that0:01:25.600,0:01:29.200 yeah so i work at a company called axiom0:01:27.680,0:01:32.000 if you can see from my0:01:29.200,0:01:32.880 background we’re um the global leader in0:01:32.000,0:01:36.000 on-demand0:01:32.880,0:01:39.119 legal talent and we started in the u.s0:01:36.000,0:01:41.840 but uh london was a pretty uh0:01:39.119,0:01:43.600 one of our earlier markets as well so0:01:41.840,0:01:45.280 the london office has been around for a0:01:43.600,0:01:48.479 really long time0:01:45.280,0:01:50.399 when i joined uh two years ago0:01:48.479,0:01:51.920 our head of sales was based in the0:01:50.399,0:01:55.119 london office0:01:51.920,0:01:56.960 so it actually kind of made sense that0:01:55.119,0:01:59.840 sales enablement was here0:01:56.960,0:02:01.840 um my predecessor you know is is british0:01:59.840,0:02:04.159 she’s been working at axiom for like 120:02:01.840,0:02:07.520 years now so she headed up enablement0:02:04.159,0:02:09.280 and started here and then uh and then0:02:07.520,0:02:11.120 here here i am so enablement just kind0:02:09.280,0:02:14.879 of stuck stuck in london0:02:11.120,0:02:17.440 um but i think being an american helps0:02:14.879,0:02:18.400 uh helps me out a lot because i can you0:02:17.440,0:02:20.239 know work0:02:18.400,0:02:22.080 with my colleagues in america i0:02:20.239,0:02:24.080 understand like0:02:22.080,0:02:25.599 uh the working cultures are very0:02:24.080,0:02:29.040 different um0:02:25.599,0:02:31.519 but it’s great to be able to represent0:02:29.040,0:02:33.519 the international team because uh i0:02:31.519,0:02:36.640 think it’s pretty common for0:02:33.519,0:02:38.080 uh us-based companies to kind of think0:02:36.640,0:02:39.200 like oh everything just happens in0:02:38.080,0:02:40.959 america and i mean0:02:39.200,0:02:42.879 most of our revenue does come from north0:02:40.959,0:02:45.760 america so it’s understandable0:02:42.879,0:02:47.040 but for someone who’s from an0:02:45.760,0:02:47.840 international market we want to make0:02:47.040,0:02:50.480 sure that0:02:47.840,0:02:51.120 their enablement is applicable to them0:02:50.480,0:02:52.800 so0:02:51.120,0:02:54.640 am i always trying to have that like0:02:52.800,0:02:57.840 international lens on0:02:54.640,0:02:59.840 how i approach things but also you know0:02:57.840,0:03:01.599 working with the us team is really fun0:02:59.840,0:03:03.760 and i get to go back to the us0:03:01.599,0:03:04.800 on the company’s dime well i used to0:03:03.760,0:03:07.360 used to0:03:04.800,0:03:09.040 covet has kind of prevented that but you0:03:07.360,0:03:11.680 know getting to go back to new york0:03:09.040,0:03:12.480 a couple times a year um is great0:03:11.680,0:03:14.720 because0:03:12.480,0:03:16.159 i love going back to america and if i0:03:14.720,0:03:16.640 can make it a work trip that’s even0:03:16.159,0:03:19.599 better0:03:16.640,0:03:21.360 that’s even better you were saying um so0:03:19.599,0:03:23.200 you’re in london0:03:21.360,0:03:24.480 how is the team structured and sort of0:03:23.200,0:03:25.360 you know what’s that makeup of the0:03:24.480,0:03:28.400 organization0:03:25.360,0:03:32.400 look like at axiom yeah so uh0:03:28.400,0:03:34.560 we are a small but mighty team of two0:03:32.400,0:03:35.840 uh for enablement so it’s just it’s0:03:34.560,0:03:38.480 myself0:03:35.840,0:03:39.200 and uh it’s my colleague emma uh she’s0:03:38.480,0:03:42.640 an associate0:03:39.200,0:03:45.440 she was a former bdr um which0:03:42.640,0:03:47.519 is was just like a perfect training to0:03:45.440,0:03:50.799 go into enablement in my opinion0:03:47.519,0:03:52.560 um and we we report into the svp of0:03:50.799,0:03:55.120 sales operations0:03:52.560,0:03:56.159 but he then reports into our head of0:03:55.120,0:03:58.840 sale so we’re0:03:56.159,0:04:01.519 very much aligned under the the sales0:03:58.840,0:04:03.439 umbrella0:04:01.519,0:04:04.560 how big you know how big is the team so0:04:03.439,0:04:06.560 it’s two of you0:04:04.560,0:04:07.920 you report up to ops and we’ll talk0:04:06.560,0:04:09.040 about that a little bit later because0:04:07.920,0:04:11.360 i’m curious0:04:09.040,0:04:13.439 what that’s like and how that impacts0:04:11.360,0:04:15.599 how enablement works there0:04:13.439,0:04:17.759 how many sellers or teammates are you0:04:15.599,0:04:21.120 supporting with the team of two though0:04:17.759,0:04:24.320 yeah so we we support about 1500:04:21.120,0:04:27.440 commercial employees so0:04:24.320,0:04:30.400 80 of that 80 of that 1500:04:27.440,0:04:30.720 so about half are quota carrying sellers0:04:30.400,0:04:33.759 and0:04:30.720,0:04:37.600 we have a hybrid of inside sales so0:04:33.759,0:04:40.240 we call them smb um and then enterprise0:04:37.600,0:04:42.639 and a majority of our sellers i would0:04:40.240,0:04:44.240 say fall into like a farmer role or0:04:42.639,0:04:46.560 more of like account management trying0:04:44.240,0:04:50.000 to grow existing logos0:04:46.560,0:04:52.000 um and then uh we have started to kind0:04:50.000,0:04:53.759 of build out a hunter profile so we can0:04:52.000,0:04:56.560 expand our client base0:04:53.759,0:04:58.400 that’s still pretty new for us um but0:04:56.560,0:05:01.759 that’s something that we’re kind of0:04:58.400,0:05:04.320 doing more and more of um we also0:05:01.759,0:05:08.000 support a bdr team i think we have about0:05:04.320,0:05:09.360 20 to 30 of them globally mostly in the0:05:08.000,0:05:11.199 us0:05:09.360,0:05:13.199 we have client success and then we have0:05:11.199,0:05:15.280 talent engagement and0:05:13.199,0:05:16.400 they’re like a sales adjacent role0:05:15.280,0:05:18.560 similar to0:05:16.400,0:05:19.919 like a sales engineer if you’re in a sas0:05:18.560,0:05:22.479 space so0:05:19.919,0:05:23.680 um and of course we support the sales0:05:22.479,0:05:26.000 leaders i mean that’s0:05:23.680,0:05:26.960 i think the most important population0:05:26.000,0:05:29.280 that enablement0:05:26.960,0:05:30.320 supports is the sales managers because0:05:29.280,0:05:33.440 without them0:05:30.320,0:05:36.479 what we do is never gonna stick so uh0:05:33.440,0:05:39.440 we support about maybe 10 or 12 of them0:05:36.479,0:05:41.840 so no dead on so dead on and again i0:05:39.440,0:05:45.440 hammer that point every time it comes up0:05:41.840,0:05:47.199 your sales leaders are the best place0:05:45.440,0:05:48.720 to focus your energy especially when0:05:47.199,0:05:50.320 you’re resource constrained which let’s0:05:48.720,0:05:52.639 be honest we all are0:05:50.320,0:05:53.440 yeah if you want to drive adoption you0:05:52.639,0:05:54.960 really want to0:05:53.440,0:05:56.960 drive change focus on those sales0:05:54.960,0:06:00.319 leaders so that’s that’s awesome0:05:56.960,0:06:01.120 now let me ask you this you said earlier0:06:00.319,0:06:04.960 that0:06:01.120,0:06:05.600 your co-conspirator in the enablement0:06:04.960,0:06:08.400 space0:06:05.600,0:06:09.919 was a former bdr and you said and that0:06:08.400,0:06:11.520 was a really great training ground why0:06:09.919,0:06:12.720 was that such a good training ground for0:06:11.520,0:06:16.160 them0:06:12.720,0:06:18.800 i think i think bdr is just0:06:16.160,0:06:19.680 an excellent feeder position for any0:06:18.800,0:06:22.639 organization0:06:19.680,0:06:24.479 so i really can’t speak highly enough of0:06:22.639,0:06:27.280 the talent that’s come through0:06:24.479,0:06:28.160 our bdr team at axiom into other parts0:06:27.280,0:06:31.600 of the business0:06:28.160,0:06:33.440 so yes we want bdrs to0:06:31.600,0:06:34.800 go into sales that’s a natural0:06:33.440,0:06:37.759 transition0:06:34.800,0:06:38.720 um but there are going to be bdrs who0:06:37.759,0:06:41.440 realize0:06:38.720,0:06:43.600 that after cold calling and you know0:06:41.440,0:06:44.240 trying to land meetings for 18 to 240:06:43.600,0:06:47.360 months that0:06:44.240,0:06:50.240 they don’t want to sell and that’s okay0:06:47.360,0:06:52.160 it’s a hard job i’m guilty of it myself0:06:50.240,0:06:53.599 i started in a sales program and i0:06:52.160,0:06:55.280 quickly was like i don’t really want to0:06:53.599,0:06:57.680 do this but i like0:06:55.280,0:06:58.800 the world of sales so how can i still be0:06:57.680,0:07:02.240 a part of that0:06:58.800,0:07:04.960 so um bdr like i said is amazing0:07:02.240,0:07:05.360 one of our sales operations manager um0:07:04.960,0:07:08.160 he0:07:05.360,0:07:08.880 came from bdr and he’s so tuned into the0:07:08.160,0:07:11.520 business0:07:08.880,0:07:12.400 because of it and same with emma my0:07:11.520,0:07:14.479 associate0:07:12.400,0:07:16.160 she’s the same way they they see how0:07:14.479,0:07:19.440 sales works firsthand0:07:16.160,0:07:20.880 they have the the right context for it0:07:19.440,0:07:22.400 that they can you know use in their0:07:20.880,0:07:22.960 roles and they know what works and what0:07:22.400,0:07:25.680 doesn’t0:07:22.960,0:07:26.319 and honestly the talent like i said that0:07:25.680,0:07:28.560 we have0:07:26.319,0:07:30.800 that has come from bdr is pretty0:07:28.560,0:07:33.440 spectacular so0:07:30.800,0:07:35.039 like you said carly yeah it’s amazing0:07:33.440,0:07:36.479 it’s a great way to just understand0:07:35.039,0:07:39.520 business pretty much0:07:36.479,0:07:42.400 like right out the gate0:07:39.520,0:07:43.520 and i don’t know axiom very well but i0:07:42.400,0:07:46.240 really applaud0:07:43.520,0:07:46.879 and and i love the fact that they seemed0:07:46.240,0:07:49.759 that people0:07:46.879,0:07:51.440 started as a bdr in many cases you said0:07:49.759,0:07:52.400 and then grow into other parts of the0:07:51.440,0:07:55.120 organization that0:07:52.400,0:07:56.479 that represents or describes a really0:07:55.120,0:07:59.120 healthy business0:07:56.479,0:08:01.280 that’s helping people grow into other0:07:59.120,0:08:03.759 roles and that’s a really0:08:01.280,0:08:05.120 i don’t know axiom from the inside or0:08:03.759,0:08:06.479 from the outside really well but that0:08:05.120,0:08:08.000 really says a lot of positive things0:08:06.479,0:08:11.039 about the business0:08:08.000,0:08:11.759 yeah i i think it’s great we obviously0:08:11.039,0:08:14.000 want them0:08:11.759,0:08:15.599 we want bdrs to go into sales like i0:08:14.000,0:08:16.400 said that’s what we plan for and vote0:08:15.599,0:08:18.240 for0:08:16.400,0:08:20.080 but we’ve had bdrs going to client0:08:18.240,0:08:23.840 success talent engagement0:08:20.080,0:08:24.560 recruiting you know hr enablement ops0:08:23.840,0:08:26.960 like and0:08:24.560,0:08:28.080 their they’re stellar employees so yeah0:08:26.960,0:08:30.560 bdr is great0:08:28.080,0:08:31.360 every company should have a bdr program0:08:30.560,0:08:33.440 nice0:08:31.360,0:08:36.959 now we’re going to switch back to the0:08:33.440,0:08:39.919 love story portion of the program here0:08:36.959,0:08:41.440 i know you love you have a passion for0:08:39.919,0:08:44.159 onboarding0:08:41.440,0:08:45.920 yes so talk to us describe a little bit0:08:44.159,0:08:46.959 about what’s going on on the onboarding0:08:45.920,0:08:48.560 program0:08:46.959,0:08:50.320 and what how you approach it what do you0:08:48.560,0:08:53.839 think about it all that0:08:50.320,0:08:55.839 yeah so i’ve always been responsible for0:08:53.839,0:08:57.600 the sales onboarding programs that in0:08:55.839,0:09:01.040 every company i’ve worked for0:08:57.600,0:09:03.680 so it’s something that i absolutely0:09:01.040,0:09:05.360 love and i love you know connecting with0:09:03.680,0:09:07.839 new hires being one of the first people0:09:05.360,0:09:08.240 that they meet when they join a company0:09:07.839,0:09:09.440 and0:09:08.240,0:09:12.000 you know walking them through their0:09:09.440,0:09:14.000 onboarding process and then seeing0:09:12.000,0:09:16.000 their development from like when they0:09:14.000,0:09:17.920 join they’re like i i don’t have a legal0:09:16.000,0:09:18.720 background at all and i have no idea0:09:17.920,0:09:21.600 what i’m0:09:18.720,0:09:24.000 doing today landing their first sale and0:09:21.600,0:09:24.720 then landing like the really big sale so0:09:24.000,0:09:27.440 i have0:09:24.720,0:09:29.279 a seller who joined about two years ago0:09:27.440,0:09:31.440 and he had a really tough market0:09:29.279,0:09:33.519 like we were i do check-ins with new0:09:31.440,0:09:37.200 hires every 30 days and0:09:33.519,0:09:38.640 he he um he had a tough market he was0:09:37.200,0:09:41.920 having a really hard time making his0:09:38.640,0:09:44.560 sales but he’s just landed a couple0:09:41.920,0:09:46.480 huge deals recently so it’s just so0:09:44.560,0:09:49.680 exciting to see that0:09:46.480,0:09:51.440 so i love onboarding um but having a0:09:49.680,0:09:54.399 remote onboarding program0:09:51.440,0:09:55.120 is like vital right now obviously we0:09:54.399,0:09:57.839 can’t0:09:55.120,0:09:59.360 sellers can’t just be sitting next to0:09:57.839,0:10:00.800 their teammates and learning through0:09:59.360,0:10:04.240 osmosis anymore0:10:00.800,0:10:07.760 so you have to have0:10:04.240,0:10:10.800 your onboarding program online somehow0:10:07.760,0:10:14.560 so we have a learning platform that0:10:10.800,0:10:16.560 has all of our onboarding videos and0:10:14.560,0:10:19.600 documents and things like that0:10:16.560,0:10:19.920 but also we’ve put in tasks as well so0:10:19.600,0:10:23.040 like0:10:19.920,0:10:24.640 hey schedule a meeting with0:10:23.040,0:10:26.160 so and so on your team to talk about0:10:24.640,0:10:28.800 this so that would be like an0:10:26.160,0:10:30.640 on-the-job or offline training but we0:10:28.800,0:10:33.519 still put that in0:10:30.640,0:10:35.600 our learning platform so that it’s0:10:33.519,0:10:36.640 comprehensive right it all lives in one0:10:35.600,0:10:38.880 place0:10:36.640,0:10:40.560 so the digital plus the in-person stuff0:10:38.880,0:10:42.800 you’ve combined together0:10:40.560,0:10:43.839 yeah exactly so they know exactly what0:10:42.800,0:10:46.079 they need to do0:10:43.839,0:10:47.519 and then those those offline ones are0:10:46.079,0:10:50.959 just literally just like a0:10:47.519,0:10:54.079 task that they can just tick off um0:10:50.959,0:10:56.320 and call recording is also0:10:54.079,0:10:58.640 the big thing i mean gong has gone0:10:56.320,0:10:59.200 gangbusters as we’ve seen they just had0:10:58.640,0:11:01.680 this0:10:59.200,0:11:02.959 incredible two billion dollar evaluation0:11:01.680,0:11:06.160 it’s unbelievable0:11:02.959,0:11:07.200 but it there’s a reason for it so call0:11:06.160,0:11:10.240 recording is0:11:07.200,0:11:12.800 like the best way to train new hires0:11:10.240,0:11:14.000 just have them listen to calls um i just0:11:12.800,0:11:15.519 had a new hire start yesterday0:11:14.000,0:11:17.440 and he’s like do you guys do call0:11:15.519,0:11:19.120 recording because that’s how i learned0:11:17.440,0:11:19.519 the best in my previous company and i0:11:19.120,0:11:22.480 said0:11:19.519,0:11:24.560 actually yes we do so um he’s just0:11:22.480,0:11:26.800 pumped just to sit there and listen to0:11:24.560,0:11:28.240 call after call and start to like script0:11:26.800,0:11:30.399 out his um0:11:28.240,0:11:31.920 his narrative and how he wants to0:11:30.399,0:11:34.240 approach selling so0:11:31.920,0:11:37.120 um when it comes to onboarding having it0:11:34.240,0:11:40.560 remote is super super super important0:11:37.120,0:11:43.040 um but also call recording0:11:40.560,0:11:43.920 just makes it a lot easier to ramp i0:11:43.040,0:11:48.000 think0:11:43.920,0:11:50.000 uh did you covet hit carly0:11:48.000,0:11:51.680 were you already well positioned to0:11:50.000,0:11:53.120 support the the digital0:11:51.680,0:11:55.120 you know were you did you already have0:11:53.120,0:11:56.079 everything in the lms were you already0:11:55.120,0:11:57.600 using0:11:56.079,0:11:59.680 gong i feel like i should get a0:11:57.600,0:12:01.760 commercial for gong going by0:11:59.680,0:12:04.160 because everybody i talk to is like i0:12:01.760,0:12:05.760 love gone0:12:04.160,0:12:08.240 to be clear i actually don’t we don’t0:12:05.760,0:12:08.240 use god0:12:08.720,0:12:13.360 we don’t use gong but um it’s just0:12:11.680,0:12:15.360 they’ve just paved the way for call0:12:13.360,0:12:18.959 recording which is pretty incredible0:12:15.360,0:12:22.639 um but we we have been0:12:18.959,0:12:25.279 using um a learning management system0:12:22.639,0:12:28.560 for sales for three years now0:12:25.279,0:12:29.839 so we were well well established when it0:12:28.560,0:12:32.800 came to0:12:29.839,0:12:34.800 scaling our onboarding and have it being0:12:32.800,0:12:37.440 uh supported remotely so we were0:12:34.800,0:12:38.240 ready for covid when that happened0:12:37.440,0:12:39.920 that’s awesome0:12:38.240,0:12:41.279 did you have to make any pivots along0:12:39.920,0:12:44.959 the way carly or were0:12:41.279,0:12:46.800 you know yeah so well we went uh we0:12:44.959,0:12:49.680 implemented a hiring freeze0:12:46.800,0:12:52.000 so onboarding actually didn’t really0:12:49.680,0:12:54.480 have a focus for us i think we had one0:12:52.000,0:12:55.279 um new hire that started like right0:12:54.480,0:12:58.480 after0:12:55.279,0:13:01.839 covid hit um and then0:12:58.480,0:13:04.399 what axiom mostly had to figure out was0:13:01.839,0:13:05.279 how are we gonna message ourselves to0:13:04.399,0:13:08.000 our clients0:13:05.279,0:13:10.079 given this new like market that we’re in0:13:08.000,0:13:12.320 right this new environment0:13:10.079,0:13:13.920 so we really had to focus from it from0:13:12.320,0:13:15.839 enablement perspective0:13:13.920,0:13:17.839 we had to focus on getting sellers0:13:15.839,0:13:19.440 comfortable with that new messaging0:13:17.839,0:13:21.200 we had a new sales tool that we were0:13:19.440,0:13:23.120 using um0:13:21.200,0:13:24.959 so training them up on that so that was0:13:23.120,0:13:27.760 a really big um0:13:24.959,0:13:29.519 push for us in the spring but now we’re0:13:27.760,0:13:32.320 picking hiring back up again0:13:29.519,0:13:34.000 so now i you know have a handful of new0:13:32.320,0:13:35.760 hires starting every week now which is0:13:34.000,0:13:38.800 super exciting so we’re back0:13:35.760,0:13:40.959 to uh the onboarding um remotely0:13:38.800,0:13:42.480 yeah you know i want to shift gears on0:13:40.959,0:13:46.240 you because earlier on0:13:42.480,0:13:49.440 you mentioned that you report to the svp0:13:46.240,0:13:50.959 of operations yes0:13:49.440,0:13:53.040 tell us a little bit about that does0:13:50.959,0:13:53.680 that influence does that modify or0:13:53.040,0:13:56.880 change0:13:53.680,0:13:58.639 uh how you think about enablement at0:13:56.880,0:14:02.720 axiom0:13:58.639,0:14:06.240 yeah so we have um we we measure0:14:02.720,0:14:09.519 a lot at axiom um which is0:14:06.240,0:14:11.440 great it’s almost like i have i don’t0:14:09.519,0:14:13.440 know what to do with all the data that0:14:11.440,0:14:16.240 we sit on so0:14:13.440,0:14:18.639 we have a sales ops team that that0:14:16.240,0:14:20.399 builds a pretty robust score card i mean0:14:18.639,0:14:23.519 like the columns on the excel0:14:20.399,0:14:27.360 go to like you know a0:14:23.519,0:14:29.040 zed like it just goes forever right0:14:27.360,0:14:31.040 in london because you didn’t say z you0:14:29.040,0:14:33.600 said z no i said zed0:14:31.040,0:14:34.240 my postcode had zed in it when i first0:14:33.600,0:14:36.240 moved and i0:14:34.240,0:14:37.920 said like you know whatever my postcode0:14:36.240,0:14:39.120 was with the z and the person on the0:14:37.920,0:14:40.959 other end of the phone was like0:14:39.120,0:14:43.199 what can you repeat that i’m like oh0:14:40.959,0:14:44.399 yeah the one letter in the alphabet0:14:43.199,0:14:48.880 that’s different0:14:44.399,0:14:49.760 right anyway so robust scorecard lots of0:14:48.880,0:14:51.920 data0:14:49.760,0:14:54.720 yes lots of data it’s updated on a0:14:51.920,0:14:57.279 monthly basis so we can kind of see how0:14:54.720,0:14:58.240 people are doing and i try and look at0:14:57.279,0:15:01.279 trends there0:14:58.240,0:15:05.040 but usually what happens is i i0:15:01.279,0:15:07.360 think of a problem or like i come across0:15:05.040,0:15:09.839 a problem and i ask our ops team0:15:07.360,0:15:11.279 can can you pull data from salesforce0:15:09.839,0:15:12.000 and i just want to see what this looks0:15:11.279,0:15:13.680 like so for0:15:12.000,0:15:15.279 example one thing i’m working on right0:15:13.680,0:15:18.079 now is0:15:15.279,0:15:19.760 um when we have a first meeting with a0:15:18.079,0:15:23.760 client or discovery0:15:19.760,0:15:25.519 um how quickly do we have a follow-up0:15:23.760,0:15:27.760 meeting or an opportunity0:15:25.519,0:15:29.839 how many of those meetings results in a0:15:27.760,0:15:33.199 follow-up meeting or opportunity0:15:29.839,0:15:33.839 um you know what’s uh you know the0:15:33.199,0:15:35.759 difference0:15:33.839,0:15:38.240 between that you know how much how much0:15:35.759,0:15:40.240 time is elapsed on average between0:15:38.240,0:15:41.279 first meeting and follow-up and that0:15:40.240,0:15:43.360 sort of thing0:15:41.279,0:15:44.399 um and you know it it’s interesting0:15:43.360,0:15:47.279 because some people0:15:44.399,0:15:48.480 will be really quick with their0:15:47.279,0:15:51.279 follow-up times0:15:48.480,0:15:52.480 and you know they’ll land an opportunity0:15:51.279,0:15:55.759 really quickly0:15:52.480,0:15:58.160 sometimes people are take a lot longer0:15:55.759,0:15:59.040 like their average days is longer but0:15:58.160,0:16:00.880 you know they’re con0:15:59.040,0:16:02.560 they’re more consistently turning their0:16:00.880,0:16:04.160 meetings into opportunities0:16:02.560,0:16:06.839 and some people just are really0:16:04.160,0:16:10.399 struggling on both accounts so0:16:06.839,0:16:12.959 um the discovery call process has been0:16:10.399,0:16:14.480 an area of focus for for me this year0:16:12.959,0:16:17.440 trying to improve that0:16:14.480,0:16:19.279 um and so you know leveraging my sales0:16:17.440,0:16:23.839 ops team to kind of help me with that0:16:19.279,0:16:25.680 data and really give me the right um0:16:23.839,0:16:27.920 the right perspective going into that0:16:25.680,0:16:31.040 exercise is super helpful0:16:27.920,0:16:32.160 no that makes sense and it does it seems0:16:31.040,0:16:34.079 like a real plus0:16:32.160,0:16:35.759 to have that tight relationship with ops0:16:34.079,0:16:37.759 there from that perspective0:16:35.759,0:16:39.759 what happened to start looking at that0:16:37.759,0:16:41.440 data were you seeing a business0:16:39.759,0:16:43.120 challenge i know you said you’re looking0:16:41.440,0:16:44.480 at discovery anyway0:16:43.120,0:16:46.480 were you seeing some trends that you0:16:44.480,0:16:47.440 said yourself geez i just wonder what’s0:16:46.480,0:16:51.199 going on or0:16:47.440,0:16:54.320 or what happened there yeah so last year0:16:51.199,0:16:55.920 one of our ops team members looked at0:16:54.320,0:16:59.920 our new logo0:16:55.920,0:17:02.320 um cycle of first time to outreach0:16:59.920,0:17:03.440 to landing a first me or landing the0:17:02.320,0:17:05.919 first win0:17:03.440,0:17:07.439 was almost a year so it was a long0:17:05.919,0:17:11.760 process0:17:07.439,0:17:14.400 so we um one of the goals was let’s try0:17:11.760,0:17:18.079 and reduce that discovery cycle time0:17:14.400,0:17:19.839 um and i think it was like once you0:17:18.079,0:17:21.760 get the first meeting to the first0:17:19.839,0:17:23.760 opportunity it was still pretty long it0:17:21.760,0:17:25.600 was like well over 100 days0:17:23.760,0:17:27.280 so i kind of knew that we had some work0:17:25.600,0:17:30.960 to do um0:17:27.280,0:17:33.600 but then uh you know covid hit0:17:30.960,0:17:34.160 and i think most of our business comes0:17:33.600,0:17:37.280 from0:17:34.160,0:17:39.679 existing clients and so0:17:37.280,0:17:41.120 when those clients weren’t buying as0:17:39.679,0:17:44.720 frequently as they probably0:17:41.120,0:17:46.080 would we really had to do a much better0:17:44.720,0:17:47.679 job in meetings0:17:46.080,0:17:50.000 finding opportunities where they might0:17:47.679,0:17:51.200 not be so obvious and that’s difficult0:17:50.000,0:17:53.600 to do0:17:51.200,0:17:54.960 and we’ve never really focused on that0:17:53.600,0:17:57.840 we never really had to0:17:54.960,0:17:58.960 because our clients who use us and know0:17:57.840,0:18:01.200 us well0:17:58.960,0:18:02.880 want to keep coming back and using our0:18:01.200,0:18:04.799 talent that we have0:18:02.880,0:18:06.080 but if they if they don’t know what they0:18:04.799,0:18:09.120 don’t know0:18:06.080,0:18:09.679 a seller has to kind of get them to that0:18:09.120,0:18:13.200 point0:18:09.679,0:18:14.799 and so um kobit really i think shed a0:18:13.200,0:18:17.200 light that we had some work to do on0:18:14.799,0:18:18.559 the content of our discovery call so i0:18:17.200,0:18:20.720 made a playbook0:18:18.559,0:18:22.160 how should you structure discovery calls0:18:20.720,0:18:25.360 what questions should you be0:18:22.160,0:18:28.080 asking what does it mean when a client0:18:25.360,0:18:30.880 says like i’ll call you when i need you0:18:28.080,0:18:31.679 um or what are the good next steps and0:18:30.880,0:18:33.520 things like that0:18:31.679,0:18:35.679 right exactly bye-bye thank you for your0:18:33.520,0:18:36.799 time i didn’t find any value in this0:18:35.679,0:18:39.919 conversation0:18:36.799,0:18:42.080 so um yeah that’s a big focus0:18:39.919,0:18:44.000 and so in sales ops like i really0:18:42.080,0:18:44.799 couldn’t do it without the data that0:18:44.000,0:18:47.360 they0:18:44.799,0:18:48.480 help us let me ask you this carly0:18:47.360,0:18:50.640 because we didn’t talk about the0:18:48.480,0:18:52.240 playbook specifically when we chatted0:18:50.640,0:18:56.880 when we’ve chatted in the past0:18:52.240,0:18:59.360 have you seen that drive any measurable0:18:56.880,0:19:00.480 improvement or is it one of those things0:18:59.360,0:19:02.720 that geez i just0:19:00.480,0:19:04.320 we just rolled it out john a month ago i0:19:02.720,0:19:06.000 don’t know0:19:04.320,0:19:07.760 yeah so we rolled it out at the0:19:06.000,0:19:11.360 beginning of the summer0:19:07.760,0:19:14.640 so um it’s still pretty new but we’re0:19:11.360,0:19:17.360 implementing a new certification program0:19:14.640,0:19:18.480 and we’re using the discovery call0:19:17.360,0:19:21.760 playbook0:19:18.480,0:19:23.200 as a part of how we expect sellers to0:19:21.760,0:19:24.160 structure their first calls and how0:19:23.200,0:19:27.760 we’re going to evaluate0:19:24.160,0:19:29.919 them so um i’ve really been leaning on0:19:27.760,0:19:31.679 the sales managers to kind of help drive0:19:29.919,0:19:33.280 that playbook and they love it which is0:19:31.679,0:19:34.080 great like the feedback’s been really0:19:33.280,0:19:36.840 good0:19:34.080,0:19:38.320 um but we just kind of need to reset0:19:36.840,0:19:40.880 expectations0:19:38.320,0:19:42.559 and you know see people do it live in0:19:40.880,0:19:43.919 their certification role plays and0:19:42.559,0:19:45.840 things like that so we’re0:19:43.919,0:19:47.440 going to go through a pretty extensive0:19:45.840,0:19:50.640 exercise to kind of0:19:47.440,0:19:51.360 get everyone to that point but um so no0:19:50.640,0:19:54.400 measurable0:19:51.360,0:19:55.120 success yet um but i do have baseline0:19:54.400,0:19:57.440 data from0:19:55.120,0:19:59.679 ops that i can use and measure so you0:19:57.440,0:20:01.600 have a pretty long sales cycle0:19:59.679,0:20:02.799 we’re in a very bizarre time so getting0:20:01.600,0:20:06.240 that early0:20:02.799,0:20:09.760 indication can be hard yeah0:20:06.240,0:20:13.120 i can talk to me about this0:20:09.760,0:20:14.080 carly you have been doing enablement for0:20:13.120,0:20:17.440 a long time0:20:14.080,0:20:20.080 i mean 80 years now yeah0:20:17.440,0:20:20.720 i know what’s something that you’ve done0:20:20.080,0:20:22.400 either in0:20:20.720,0:20:24.480 in the current job at axiom or in the0:20:22.400,0:20:25.280 past you’re like geez this was a great0:20:24.480,0:20:27.679 challenge0:20:25.280,0:20:29.200 huge opportunity super proud of of what0:20:27.679,0:20:32.720 we were able to accomplish0:20:29.200,0:20:35.679 share with us one of those yeah um0:20:32.720,0:20:36.640 so i joined axiom two years ago last0:20:35.679,0:20:39.760 week0:20:36.640,0:20:41.919 and my second day on the job0:20:39.760,0:20:43.840 uh my boss says to me all right you’re0:20:41.919,0:20:46.799 planning our sales kickoff0:20:43.840,0:20:49.120 it’s in january new york um it’s our0:20:46.799,0:20:52.480 first global kickoff0:20:49.120,0:20:55.120 it’s like all right cool so that’s um0:20:52.480,0:20:56.559 a lot of pressure they had done regional0:20:55.120,0:20:59.200 kickoffs the year before0:20:56.559,0:21:00.640 so people were you know expecting0:20:59.200,0:21:02.000 another kickoff but i don’t think they0:21:00.640,0:21:05.039 realized it would be global yet0:21:02.000,0:21:07.200 they had heard rumors so um0:21:05.039,0:21:08.880 i had planned and executed it it kind of0:21:07.200,0:21:09.440 felt like planning a wedding all over0:21:08.880,0:21:13.440 again0:21:09.440,0:21:16.720 um like it was total event planning mode0:21:13.440,0:21:19.919 um and at the time we had0:21:16.720,0:21:21.760 uh this pretty badass female ceo and i0:21:19.919,0:21:23.360 was just like super pumped to work at a0:21:21.760,0:21:26.320 company that had a female ceo0:21:23.360,0:21:26.640 and um i was a little intimidated by her0:21:26.320,0:21:29.120 because0:21:26.640,0:21:30.799 i mean you know she was i just really0:21:29.120,0:21:34.000 looked up to her and so0:21:30.799,0:21:37.360 um sales kickoff rolls around0:21:34.000,0:21:39.679 um everyone’s blown away and she herself0:21:37.360,0:21:42.159 was so impressed with0:21:39.679,0:21:44.159 the quality of the event and how0:21:42.159,0:21:44.640 smoothly everything ran that she sent me0:21:44.159,0:21:46.720 this0:21:44.640,0:21:47.840 glowing email afterwards and it was0:21:46.720,0:21:49.919 definitely like0:21:47.840,0:21:51.200 my it was a pinch me moment i was about0:21:49.919,0:21:54.240 to get on the tube0:21:51.200,0:21:56.799 and i see this email coming from her to0:21:54.240,0:21:57.679 me it wasn’t a whole company email she0:21:56.799,0:22:00.559 was just like i’m0:21:57.679,0:22:01.280 so impressed i go to so many conferences0:22:00.559,0:22:03.440 um0:22:01.280,0:22:06.400 this was so well done and you know being0:22:03.440,0:22:08.559 four months in at axiom at that point0:22:06.400,0:22:09.520 um i couldn’t have really been more0:22:08.559,0:22:12.640 proud of myself0:22:09.520,0:22:13.360 to for the impression that i was able to0:22:12.640,0:22:16.080 make0:22:13.360,0:22:16.559 um on the executive team so quickly and0:22:16.080,0:22:19.840 um0:22:16.559,0:22:20.799 so the bar was set very high for 20190:22:19.840,0:22:23.280 sko0:22:20.799,0:22:24.159 i was able to to meet it for 2020 which0:22:23.280,0:22:25.840 was great0:22:24.159,0:22:27.200 i’m kind of bummed we probably won’t we0:22:25.840,0:22:28.159 definitely won’t be having an in-person0:22:27.200,0:22:30.559 sko0:22:28.159,0:22:32.400 in january but um because i actually0:22:30.559,0:22:34.960 really do love that part of my job0:22:32.400,0:22:36.559 i’ll have to think of a fun way but but0:22:34.960,0:22:38.799 yeah to me that was just like0:22:36.559,0:22:40.159 probably one of my most proud moments0:22:38.799,0:22:42.799 for sure0:22:40.159,0:22:43.600 is she still the ceo there no so she0:22:42.799,0:22:46.559 actually just0:22:43.600,0:22:48.720 moved on um this summer so we just got a0:22:46.559,0:22:50.960 new ceo so axiom is0:22:48.720,0:22:52.240 in you know it’s a period of change0:22:50.960,0:22:55.120 which is very exciting0:22:52.240,0:22:56.960 uh david mcveigh who used to head up0:22:55.120,0:23:00.320 global sales over at gartner0:22:56.960,0:23:02.400 so um it’s gonna be a really0:23:00.320,0:23:04.000 interesting and fun time i think someone0:23:02.400,0:23:06.000 who comes from a sales background i’m0:23:04.000,0:23:07.840 personally super excited about it0:23:06.000,0:23:09.280 i think he probably understands the0:23:07.840,0:23:11.520 importance of enablement0:23:09.280,0:23:14.400 uh so i think uh there’s gonna be a lot0:23:11.520,0:23:16.159 of really good things to come for us0:23:14.400,0:23:18.320 that’s awesome that’s awesome what was0:23:16.159,0:23:20.400 that what was the hardest part about0:23:18.320,0:23:23.840 that event if i could ask you0:23:20.400,0:23:27.440 um i think logistics0:23:23.840,0:23:30.720 was really difficult so finding hotels0:23:27.440,0:23:34.159 that fit the axiom vibe that were0:23:30.720,0:23:35.840 in our price range in midtown manhattan0:23:34.159,0:23:36.880 in new york yeah i was gonna say in0:23:35.840,0:23:39.520 manhattan0:23:36.880,0:23:41.279 in midtown manhattan for 200 well i0:23:39.520,0:23:42.960 think there was about 150 people that0:23:41.279,0:23:45.279 were traveling in0:23:42.960,0:23:47.200 that was not easy and i just remember i0:23:45.279,0:23:48.080 think i had like reached out to 500:23:47.200,0:23:51.520 hotels0:23:48.080,0:23:53.360 and like i was just so like0:23:51.520,0:23:54.559 done with it i was like can we just pick0:23:53.360,0:23:57.440 a hotel already0:23:54.559,0:23:58.960 it’s october like we we need to get this0:23:57.440,0:24:01.120 stuff signed0:23:58.960,0:24:02.000 um so to me that was definitely the0:24:01.120,0:24:05.200 hardest part0:24:02.000,0:24:07.360 um and then we had a swag0:24:05.200,0:24:08.720 issue which was really funny in the end0:24:07.360,0:24:12.080 but um0:24:08.720,0:24:14.320 you know it it all worked out so i love0:24:12.080,0:24:16.480 this story carly because0:24:14.320,0:24:18.320 when we talk about enablement we talk0:24:16.480,0:24:20.640 about creating content training0:24:18.320,0:24:24.240 onboarding we don’t talk about0:24:20.640,0:24:25.520 uh event planning yeah but it’s a part0:24:24.240,0:24:27.120 of it sometimes0:24:25.520,0:24:28.880 yeah it depends i mean we didn’t have a0:24:27.120,0:24:32.159 marketing team at the time0:24:28.880,0:24:35.360 so enablement was responsible for every0:24:32.159,0:24:38.559 part of sko um0:24:35.360,0:24:41.279 and yeah it was uh0:24:38.559,0:24:43.520 it was crazy the next year was a lot0:24:41.279,0:24:46.320 smoother because i knew what to expect0:24:43.520,0:24:47.919 and i like and had it all figured out um0:24:46.320,0:24:50.080 and of course like this year would have0:24:47.919,0:24:52.000 been like a total slam dunk but0:24:50.080,0:24:53.840 we’re not going to be doing it so this0:24:52.000,0:24:56.799 year you’re going to have to find0:24:53.840,0:24:58.080 200 unique hotels for each person to go0:24:56.799,0:25:01.039 individually0:24:58.080,0:25:02.400 yeah oh my gosh no no no no no okay that0:25:01.039,0:25:05.760 would be a nightmare0:25:02.400,0:25:08.159 to be a nightmare let me ask you this um0:25:05.760,0:25:08.960 i have had a blast yeah this has been0:25:08.159,0:25:11.600 fun0:25:08.960,0:25:14.480 and you are fantastic carly anything we0:25:11.600,0:25:17.600 didn’t talk about though0:25:14.480,0:25:20.000 um they like john0:25:17.600,0:25:20.799 we should have talked about that well0:25:20.000,0:25:22.400 you know i0:25:20.799,0:25:24.240 you know the last time we chatted one0:25:22.400,0:25:27.760 thing that we did talk about0:25:24.240,0:25:28.480 um in terms of metrics was time to first0:25:27.760,0:25:31.600 sale0:25:28.480,0:25:32.960 so that is um we we measure time to for0:25:31.600,0:25:36.080 sale at axioms0:25:32.960,0:25:39.440 but we also measure you know their0:25:36.080,0:25:41.200 the new hires um six month average sales0:25:39.440,0:25:44.159 and 12 month average sales0:25:41.200,0:25:46.159 which i think is a better metric but0:25:44.159,0:25:47.919 time to for sale is super interesting i0:25:46.159,0:25:49.039 don’t love that metric i think you have0:25:47.919,0:25:52.400 kind of shared0:25:49.039,0:25:55.200 hair shared a similar point of view um0:25:52.400,0:25:56.960 so my advice for people is if you’re0:25:55.200,0:26:00.080 using time to for sale is like0:25:56.960,0:26:01.840 the metric to base your new higher0:26:00.080,0:26:03.360 success on or even if your enablement0:26:01.840,0:26:05.760 program is successful like0:26:03.360,0:26:07.279 don’t do it like there’s so many better0:26:05.760,0:26:10.720 metrics out there0:26:07.279,0:26:11.760 and uh and a new hire’s time to for sale0:26:10.720,0:26:15.200 could be influenced by0:26:11.760,0:26:17.120 so many different things um that0:26:15.200,0:26:19.360 it’s it’s really not the best metric in0:26:17.120,0:26:20.960 my opinion which one of those i mean0:26:19.360,0:26:23.039 we talked about other ones you know0:26:20.960,0:26:25.200 average sales six twelve months0:26:23.039,0:26:27.440 time to full productivity which of those0:26:25.200,0:26:28.960 if you were only doing one0:26:27.440,0:26:30.480 and you didn’t have the luxury of having0:26:28.960,0:26:33.120 volumes of data in front of you0:26:30.480,0:26:34.159 would you pick just one of those and0:26:33.120,0:26:35.279 which one0:26:34.159,0:26:37.760 i don’t know if i would pick one of0:26:35.279,0:26:40.080 those um one of the ones0:26:37.760,0:26:42.480 that were that we measure right now is0:26:40.080,0:26:45.600 consistency of contribution0:26:42.480,0:26:48.480 so um it’s0:26:45.600,0:26:49.039 and we expect our sellers to make at0:26:48.480,0:26:50.960 least0:26:49.039,0:26:53.279 two sales a month like that’s kind of0:26:50.960,0:26:55.279 what that’s our expectation right so0:26:53.279,0:26:57.360 how many months are sellers making a0:26:55.279,0:26:58.080 sale um and so we looked at it you know0:26:57.360,0:27:00.159 over the first0:26:58.080,0:27:01.840 six months of the year that are they at0:27:00.159,0:27:04.880 you know 1000:27:01.840,0:27:08.480 you know 89 500:27:04.880,0:27:09.600 um to me that i think is the best0:27:08.480,0:27:12.000 leading indicator0:27:09.600,0:27:13.840 for you know they’re doing really well0:27:12.000,0:27:15.760 or we might need to look into something0:27:13.840,0:27:17.279 and see see what their activity levels0:27:15.760,0:27:19.679 are i love that0:27:17.279,0:27:20.399 and and i think that’s the best one i’ve0:27:19.679,0:27:23.679 heard so0:27:20.399,0:27:25.600 before currently if you know you should0:27:23.679,0:27:27.679 know how long your sales cycle is your0:27:25.600,0:27:28.960 pipeline all of that stuff you should be0:27:27.679,0:27:31.440 able to figure out0:27:28.960,0:27:32.080 whether it’s two sales a month two sales0:27:31.440,0:27:34.960 a quarter0:27:32.080,0:27:35.360 two sales a year whatever it is yep you0:27:34.960,0:27:37.440 should0:27:35.360,0:27:39.120 figure that out and if it’s small enough0:27:37.440,0:27:40.640 like two sales a month is easy to0:27:39.120,0:27:43.279 capture and measure0:27:40.640,0:27:44.000 that’s such a great metric to count on0:27:43.279,0:27:45.360 yeah0:27:44.000,0:27:47.360 yeah it’s definitely i think my my0:27:45.360,0:27:49.760 current favorite for sure0:27:47.360,0:27:50.960 nice all right well i am going to let0:27:49.760,0:27:54.000 you get back to your0:27:50.960,0:27:54.880 lovely day in london thank you so0:27:54.000,0:27:56.880 appreciate you0:27:54.880,0:27:59.120 and you taking time out of your day so i0:27:56.880,0:27:59.919 think by saying this was both a love0:27:59.120,0:28:02.399 story0:27:59.919,0:28:04.080 it was that brought you to the uk yeah0:28:02.399,0:28:05.440 there’s a tremendous set of lessons on0:28:04.080,0:28:08.399 enablement0:28:05.440,0:28:09.440 i’m glad thank you so much and thank you0:28:08.399,0:28:11.440 everybody0:28:09.440,0:28:13.840 have a great rest of everybody’s day bye0:28:11.440,0:28:13.840 carly